How to Make Money in Real Estate: The Right Way (Tyler Cauble's Story)

[00:00:00] So today we have Tyler Cobble on our show.

[00:00:04] I know, so excited to talk to him again.

[00:00:06] So how did you meet Tyler?

[00:00:07] So we met, we were at a speaking event called Better Life Tribe, Brandon Turner in Denver and I just sat next to him at lunch.

[00:00:14] And he's in EO Nashville. We started chatting. He's a real estate guy, commercial guy.

[00:00:19] And we started going down these rabbit holes on deals.

[00:00:22] And next thing you know, he's talking about he has a documentary company because he's a real-time entrepreneur.

[00:00:28] It's got a lot of businesses. And I started asking him about it and I brought up our property in Sedota, Orchard Canyon.

[00:00:35] Orchard Canyon, yeah. And he's like, I'd like to go.

[00:00:37] And of course, you know, I light up when I talk about this place. Orchard Canyon is just special.

[00:00:43] So it's one of the best purchases I've made in a long time. I have no debt on it and I probably will never sell it.

[00:00:49] It'll go to my kids. But anyway, so he saw that and he flew out and you're going to see the results.

[00:00:56] Well, I think what's so great about this podcast is he did do a documentary, Orchard Canyon. It's awesome. You guys got to check it out.

[00:01:02] It's on YouTube if you just go to Tyler Cobble, C-A-U-B-L-E.

[00:01:07] But really, he's a real estate guy. So he talks about, you know, all this commercial real estate that he bought in Nashville, some of the things that he screwed up on early on when he first started.

[00:01:18] And, you know, he's just such a good mentor to people as well that I think, you know, people are going to get a lot out of this interview.

[00:01:24] Well, you have to be in the game to know what to ask. And that's what I loved about him. When I sat down next to him, you know, you know, immediately as you start to chat with somebody like whatever business you're in, you know, if somebody next to you knows your business or not.

[00:01:38] And all of a sudden, then you just kind of you put a little line out and then it goes further and further and further. You don't know how far that can go.

[00:01:44] And so, you know, I was impressed because here's a guy that's done really well in commercial real estate and knows the right questions to ask.

[00:01:52] And that's the most important thing about doing a documentary. You can't just film stuff.

[00:01:57] I mean, he actually knows the right things to ask. And that's why I think this is going to be so good.

[00:02:02] Yeah, it's not just a documentary on just the property. It's the cash flow behind the property.

[00:02:06] It's in all. This is how all his videos are. It's the deal itself. Like how. Why does this deal work?

[00:02:11] Did the deal work as good as it expected or worse than expected? And what happened?

[00:02:16] So behind the deal. Yeah.

[00:02:19] So I think you guys are going to enjoy this.

[00:02:29] Hey, Tyler, great to see you again.

[00:02:31] Yeah, excited to be here, man. Thank you guys for having me back on the show and excited to dive into our trip to Sedona with you today.

[00:02:40] I know. Thanks, man. That was great. You guys came out here with the with the camera crew.

[00:02:44] And but before we go there, like I think most people, they always like, how do I start? Right.

[00:02:51] Like you started. You've been very successful. Also time the markets perfectly.

[00:02:55] And also you branched out at all this other stuff. You got restaurants, you got bars, you've got this documentary company and obviously part of EO, which is something that I started in.

[00:03:08] And so why don't we start with that? What was the first property that you started with?

[00:03:15] Yeah, that's that's a great question. So I have an interesting entree into the world of commercial real estate.

[00:03:21] I dropped out of college. I was in sales, did really well in sales.

[00:03:25] I sold knives over at Cutco, right? Kind of did the whole Cutco knife thing for a while.

[00:03:30] And that was incredibly successful for me. Dropped out of college and started working for a boutique developer as the in-house leasing agent.

[00:03:38] This was back in 2013. The market was entirely different back then.

[00:03:43] And there wasn't a lot of activity going on. There weren't a lot of businesses leasing commercial space.

[00:03:48] So he had some vacancy and some class A product that he had built.

[00:03:52] So I started working with him, got to sit in on every development meeting every week.

[00:03:56] Despite just being a leasing broker, I wanted to go out of my way to put myself into those situations.

[00:04:01] After two years, I learned how to put together development deals and went out and found a project that I knew would check all of their boxes.

[00:04:09] It was a 2.57 acre lot that was zoned for 57 townhomes.

[00:04:17] We ended up being able to fit 42 units on it.

[00:04:19] So I found that deal, brought it to the company.

[00:04:22] We put it under contract and I ended up partnering with them.

[00:04:25] It was the deal of a lifetime.

[00:04:27] I got 10% profit share.

[00:04:29] I didn't have any money.

[00:04:30] I didn't have to sign on any debt.

[00:04:32] And I tell people today, I would do that deal time and time again if I could.

[00:04:37] So it was a great first deal.

[00:04:39] Well, first of all, before we just gloss over that, because I think it's funny because when I first met Robert Kiyosaki years ago,

[00:04:47] he used to tell people, come work for me for free.

[00:04:52] And there's a very small percentage of people that will go do or add some kind of apprenticeship, you know, come here, work for people, you know, leave what you're doing.

[00:05:01] If you want to learn this business, you got to learn it somehow.

[00:05:03] And they don't realize, like, the knowledge that you had for two years sitting there in those meetings, just absorbing everything.

[00:05:12] Also, well-knowing that you are going to use that to go out and leverage it yourself.

[00:05:17] I don't think people really quite understand how powerful that is, right?

[00:05:22] Yeah, it's incredibly powerful.

[00:05:24] I mean, obviously, I wasn't getting paid to do any of that, right?

[00:05:28] I was a commercial real estate broker working 100% on commission.

[00:05:31] If I didn't close a lease, if I didn't close a deal, I wasn't getting paid.

[00:05:35] Yet here I am sitting in on these development meetings every week just because I wanted to surround myself with the people that were doing what I wanted to be doing.

[00:05:43] And I think that's incredibly powerful.

[00:05:45] And yeah, if I had to go get coffee, I was going to do it.

[00:05:48] If I had to go pick up lunch for everybody, I was going to do it.

[00:05:50] It didn't matter. I was going to make sure I was in that room.

[00:05:52] Yeah, that two years really changed the trajectory of your financial future, your life.

[00:05:59] You're obviously the legacy.

[00:06:01] Everything you're doing is a result of that two-year commitment.

[00:06:05] That's right.

[00:06:06] Yeah, and thinking back on it, two years sounds like a long time, but it's really not that much when you're thinking about a one-hour, two-hour meeting every week for basically 104 weeks, right?

[00:06:19] Right. And like you said, I mean, it changed everything.

[00:06:24] Most commercial real estate brokers don't get that kind of experience.

[00:06:27] They don't get to be in-house.

[00:06:28] They don't get to see how these deals are put together.

[00:06:29] And having that side of things really helped propel me, one, to start my own brokerage and advise people from an investment perspective better.

[00:06:39] But two, when I started syndicating, raising capital, doing my own deals, I brought a unique sense of development to the table in addition to my deal-fighting abilities.

[00:06:50] Yeah, I think what you now know is it's just a system.

[00:06:56] You just got put into a system and you learned their system and then you probably changed yours a little bit.

[00:07:02] But the reality is it's literally a system, right?

[00:07:05] That most people don't know.

[00:07:07] So when you're on the outside, it looks really undaunting, but it's not.

[00:07:12] It's just a system.

[00:07:14] Wouldn't you agree with that?

[00:07:16] Oh, 100%.

[00:07:17] I mean, I say that all the time.

[00:07:19] Commercial real estate isn't easy, but it is very simple.

[00:07:22] You just got to know the steps to do it.

[00:07:25] And I'll use another cliche here.

[00:07:27] It's not about what you know.

[00:07:28] It's about who you know, right?

[00:07:30] When I was first getting started, and even to this day on the deals that I do, I'm not an expert on everything.

[00:07:35] And I really don't want to pretend to be an expert on everything because I'm only going to hurt myself or hurt my investors.

[00:07:40] So I'm the first person in the room to say, hey, I don't know anything about managing a hotel.

[00:07:45] Tell me what it's like.

[00:07:46] How is that different from managing apartments?

[00:07:49] Because I want to know, and I want to get it right.

[00:07:51] So I'll bring in the expert on civil engineering.

[00:07:55] I'll bring in the expert on hotel management.

[00:07:57] I'll bring in the expert on that local market, whatever it is, to be on my team.

[00:08:02] And I'm happy to divvy up the pie that way.

[00:08:05] Also, it's a great way to learn.

[00:08:07] Like, that's the thing that I've learned.

[00:08:08] Like, you know, well, I know we're going to get to this, but you came out to my hotel.

[00:08:14] And once when I bought that, I was like, oh, no.

[00:08:17] Now what?

[00:08:18] Like, I'm about to run this thing.

[00:08:19] Right?

[00:08:20] Right.

[00:08:20] Like, but that's right.

[00:08:21] Point.

[00:08:22] You find the right people.

[00:08:23] And you know, I only go up there five or six times a year and I have the right people in place.

[00:08:29] And every time I go, I'm a sponge.

[00:08:31] I'm learning from them.

[00:08:32] I'm asking questions, even though, even though I own it.

[00:08:36] And it's awesome.

[00:08:38] People don't realize how awesome that is.

[00:08:41] That's right.

[00:08:42] Yeah.

[00:08:42] I mean, you got to constantly be a student.

[00:08:44] I mean, that's one thing that y'all are both amazing at, right?

[00:08:47] Is constantly asking the right questions and being curious.

[00:08:51] I don't think that you could ever lose that if you want to continue to grow and continue to be better every day.

[00:08:57] And that's why it was fun hanging out with y'all while we were there.

[00:09:00] I mean, you were, you know, as much, you know, curious about some of the thing.

[00:09:05] You were curious about why we were curious, which, you know, to me, it makes it so much more fun.

[00:09:10] Yeah.

[00:09:10] Isn't that the truth?

[00:09:11] So is that curiosity what led you into doing these documentaries?

[00:09:16] That's a great question.

[00:09:18] I think so.

[00:09:19] Yeah.

[00:09:19] I mean, it's definitely a part of it, right?

[00:09:21] Because when I was first getting started in commercial real estate, I was really frustrated

[00:09:25] by the lack of educational content out there or the lack of stories, right?

[00:09:33] You know, if you go to business school, they load you up with all these case studies, right?

[00:09:38] There's nothing like that for commercial real estate where I can go through and read case studies

[00:09:42] and learn how this is done.

[00:09:43] You kind of almost just have to put yourself in the room with, you know, the Ken McElroys of the world, right?

[00:09:49] Here are the stories directly from them.

[00:09:52] And so as the YouTube channel was starting to kind of gain steam, I thought, you know what?

[00:09:58] I want to create the content that I wish I'd had when I was first getting started.

[00:10:03] And it was basically these many case studies on these projects.

[00:10:07] And so that's where it came from, having the curiosity of how are these people finding these deals?

[00:10:12] How are they pulling them together?

[00:10:14] Because we oftentimes see the press release, right?

[00:10:17] You know, this property sold for $30 million.

[00:10:20] Congratulations.

[00:10:20] They bought it for five.

[00:10:22] There's a lot of money in it.

[00:10:23] But we all know there were roller coaster rides.

[00:10:28] What was the ups?

[00:10:29] What were the downs?

[00:10:30] Where did you actually lose money?

[00:10:32] What would you not do again?

[00:10:33] Like, it's fun to hear that side of the story because it humanizes it.

[00:10:38] Plus, if it was such an easy, good deal, everyone would have bought it, right?

[00:10:42] So there had to be a reason or a vision or something that they knew that not everybody knew in order to make the purchase.

[00:10:50] That's exactly right.

[00:10:52] And I think that that's what makes this journey so fun for me is because we're being intentional about the types of properties that we go out and look at.

[00:11:02] And oftentimes, the developers, the investors, the teams behind these projects are as interesting as the projects themselves.

[00:11:10] What I'm not doing is going out there and touring at Dollar General, right?

[00:11:14] We're coming out to Orchard Canyon, right?

[00:11:16] Because that, to me, is fascinating.

[00:11:19] And I think that if you show people how, you know, for example, if you show somebody how Ken McElroy did Orchard Canyon, somebody might be able to do that to the local rundown hotel down the street from them and help turn around and revitalize the neighborhood.

[00:11:35] And I think that's a really fascinating way to approach you two.

[00:11:39] It was funny.

[00:11:40] I know when you came out, we spent several days together and we were all hanging out, just a bunch of entrepreneurs having fun.

[00:11:47] One of the things that I remember we discussed was that we always have the end in mind at the beginning.

[00:11:55] So I think that a lot of times, like that example you had where it's 5 million turning into, say, 25 million or 30 million.

[00:12:05] You know, nobody ever thinks it's going to be that, but they always have an end.

[00:12:10] They always have a goal.

[00:12:11] They always have a target that they're marching toward in one year, two years, three years, five years, whatever it is.

[00:12:19] There's always something at the end, even at the beginning, right?

[00:12:23] You don't just buy these things blindly and then kind of muddle through it, right?

[00:12:27] That's exactly right.

[00:12:28] I mean, you know, when you get into it, I mean, you hear this all the time in real estate, and it really is true.

[00:12:34] But when I was younger in real estate, I always hated hearing it because I was like, I'm so tired of people saying that.

[00:12:38] But you do make your money on the front end when you buy, right?

[00:12:42] Because if you buy something right, you can mess up everything after that point and still do fine, right?

[00:12:49] If you buy something wrong, it doesn't matter how many things you do, right?

[00:12:53] You might not ever recover from that, right?

[00:12:56] And so I completely agree.

[00:12:58] And that doesn't mean that, hey, we've got one exit in mind.

[00:13:01] You know, with guys like you, guys like me, we're like, no, there's 37 different possibilities or directions that we could take this.

[00:13:08] So, you know, I haven't necessarily chosen one, but it's not to say that we haven't thought through that.

[00:13:13] Yeah, no, that's a very good point.

[00:13:15] So that's kind of interesting.

[00:13:17] So you're basically saying that if you're buying it correctly, that that's how you get how you make money.

[00:13:25] And I think so many people, they think that they just have to buy something and it's all the things that they're going to do that's going to have them make money.

[00:13:34] Yeah, I think that that is one thing that a lot of investors get wrong is that they get overly eager to just get a deal and they'll buy anything, right?

[00:13:45] I mean, before we went live, I was telling Ken, you know, I haven't bought a deal in two years.

[00:13:49] And it's not for lack of trying.

[00:13:51] I've been looking.

[00:13:52] There's just nothing that checks the boxes.

[00:13:54] Now, I could have bought plenty of properties in that time, but none of them really checked all of the boxes to me to be a screaming deal.

[00:14:03] Right.

[00:14:03] And I think a lot of investors, especially newer investors, they get excited.

[00:14:08] They get tired and fatigued of waiting for the right one.

[00:14:12] And they pick one that's just good enough.

[00:14:13] Well, here's the problem with that.

[00:14:15] The deal that's just good enough is going to take up your investor's capital.

[00:14:19] It's going to take up your balance sheet.

[00:14:22] And then guess what?

[00:14:23] That perfect deal is coming tomorrow.

[00:14:25] It almost always happens.

[00:14:27] And so now, because your balance sheet is tied up, your investors have already put all their capital into this deal.

[00:14:32] You won't get to do it.

[00:14:33] So if you buy right on the front end, I mean, like I said, you can kind of mess everything else up.

[00:14:40] I had a deal where it was the first deal that I ever did.

[00:14:44] It was a $575,000 deal.

[00:14:48] And it was a two tenant, 6,000 square foot building in this little suburb of Nashville.

[00:14:54] It was vacant.

[00:14:55] And so I had convinced two investors to throw in $50,000 each to buy this building with me.

[00:15:01] And I'll show you how much things can go wrong.

[00:15:04] It's my first deal.

[00:15:05] So I'm learning a lot, right?

[00:15:07] We get in there.

[00:15:08] I signed two leases with tenants.

[00:15:10] And I get a call that one of my partners has stolen $10 million from his investors, and he's disappeared.

[00:15:19] And so now we're scrambling trying to figure out what are we going to do with this deal?

[00:15:24] And because I didn't want it to get frozen, right?

[00:15:26] The assets would get frozen by the FBI during the investigation.

[00:15:30] Ended up calling one of the tenants.

[00:15:31] And I said, hey, if you buy this building, your mortgage will actually be cheaper than the rent you're paying.

[00:15:38] Here's how we'll structure it.

[00:15:40] And we fire sold it to them for $750,000.

[00:15:44] If you run the math on that on a per square foot basis with two tenants in it, it's a really, really good price.

[00:15:49] But $575,000, which is like $80 or $81 a foot, is an even better price.

[00:15:55] So because we bought it right on that deal, I was able to walk away despite the circumstances and still return 8% annualized to my investors on that one.

[00:16:05] Yeah.

[00:16:06] That's an excellent point.

[00:16:07] And I think there's a couple of things I picked up on there.

[00:16:10] One is that just because you can buy doesn't mean you should.

[00:16:15] And so the worst part, wouldn't you agree, Tyler, is actually pushing pause when you have momentum.

[00:16:24] That's so frustrating.

[00:16:25] Like, it drives me nuts.

[00:16:27] Like, we have capital.

[00:16:28] We have infrastructure.

[00:16:28] We have track record.

[00:16:30] We have investors that want to buy.

[00:16:31] We have all that stuff.

[00:16:32] And then I or you are all going, no, now's not the time.

[00:16:37] And so it's like beating off everyone at that point, you know, because you're just trying to beat them away from the deal, you know.

[00:16:46] Yeah.

[00:16:46] They're literally saying, well, we had investors that were frustrated with us, you know.

[00:16:51] And I was like, guys, it's overpriced.

[00:16:54] It's too hot right now.

[00:16:55] You just got to trust me.

[00:16:56] And then they would invest somewhere else, which is fine.

[00:16:59] You know, maybe they saw something that I didn't.

[00:17:01] But the reality is that that's really, really, really hard.

[00:17:05] And the other one is, like, even Orchard Canyon.

[00:17:09] I have so many exits, if I want, on that property.

[00:17:13] So many verticals for revenue and income and so many exits.

[00:17:17] And, you know, when you buy something correctly, you have lots of options.

[00:17:24] That's right.

[00:17:24] I mean, I've experienced the same stuff the past couple of years, right?

[00:17:27] I've had investors get frustrated with me for not putting their capital to work.

[00:17:32] You know, they're kicking the door down saying, hey, I've got, you know, this amount of money.

[00:17:35] I want to give you, please put it in a deal.

[00:17:36] And I'm saying, hey, I'll keep you in mind.

[00:17:38] We don't have anything right now.

[00:17:40] I've had team members get frustrated, right?

[00:17:43] Because they want to build up their portfolio.

[00:17:44] They want to go out and find interesting deals and work on other things.

[00:17:48] And, you know, it's tough.

[00:17:50] But sometimes you got to be that guy, right?

[00:17:52] Because you know that that is the prudent thing to be doing in certain types of markets.

[00:17:57] I think, you know, if there are any LP investors listening to this, be wary of the GPs that just

[00:18:05] always have deals no matter what kind of market it is.

[00:18:09] And they're always willing to take your money and put it to work because the smart ones that

[00:18:13] I know, they will turn investor capital away when they don't have the right deals because

[00:18:20] it's not worth putting an investor in a bad deal just to collect a fee.

[00:18:24] Well, and it's also the relationship, right?

[00:18:27] Like if you make your investors money, they invest in your next deal.

[00:18:30] If you just have a short term way of looking at it, you want to get your fees, but you

[00:18:34] don't really care how the deal does because you're getting your fees.

[00:18:38] That's right.

[00:18:39] Yeah.

[00:18:39] So, I mean, you know, make sure that your incentives are properly aligned, right?

[00:18:44] I mean, I think this is kind of basic, but, you know, in terms of like our deals,

[00:18:48] our investors get a preferred return and then we just have a pair of pursue split, right?

[00:18:54] Make sure, and we don't fee up the deal, right?

[00:18:57] We collect, you know, like 1% acquisition fees, right?

[00:19:00] I've seen guys take 3%, 4%, 5%, 6% acquisition fees.

[00:19:03] And that is crazy to me.

[00:19:05] Like a major red flag, you're taking 5% on the front end.

[00:19:10] It's like, this guy's just trying to make a fee and he's not going to be incentivized

[00:19:14] to continue working on this.

[00:19:16] So I think it's important to make sure that everybody's interests are aligned when you're

[00:19:21] doing that.

[00:19:22] Yeah, I know.

[00:19:23] We sold a building in Tucson.

[00:19:26] It was not a very big one, a couple hundred units.

[00:19:29] And the guy couldn't raise the money.

[00:19:32] Like, so he gave us non-refundable.

[00:19:34] Then he couldn't perform and couldn't get the debt and the equity.

[00:19:39] So then we gave more time and gave more time.

[00:19:41] And he just kept doing like $150,000 to $200,000 additional non-refundable fully released.

[00:19:47] So when we finally got to the point, like six months later, he had like $800,000 or $900,000

[00:19:53] that had been released to us.

[00:19:56] And we were like coaching him like, dude, we'll help you close.

[00:20:00] Like we want you to close because also I was like, I don't know how he's buying it at this

[00:20:05] price, but he is.

[00:20:06] And so we were happy with the price.

[00:20:08] So I was trying to help him close it.

[00:20:09] But anyway, long story short, he ended up closing it.

[00:20:13] It was a long escrow, longer than we would normally do.

[00:20:16] But you know how you get the closing statement.

[00:20:18] You see everything?

[00:20:19] He had over a million dollars of fees rolled to him, to your point on those acquisitions.

[00:20:26] Acquisition fees.

[00:20:27] And I was like, oh man, this is front loaded too.

[00:20:31] So it's not only, I would call it a marginal deal, if that, but he front loaded it on fees.

[00:20:38] And you know, anyway, he's not around.

[00:20:41] Playing that a little bit because people listening might not understand.

[00:20:44] Yeah.

[00:20:44] What it means is, well, Tyler touched on it.

[00:20:47] Well, you know, if there's, you know, let's say the deal is, you know, $30 million.

[00:20:54] Um, well, a 1% fee of $30 million is $300,000.

[00:20:59] 2% is $600,000.

[00:21:01] 3% is $900,000.

[00:21:02] Um, I would say that he was over 3%, you know, and the right thing is one.

[00:21:08] Uh, that is right.

[00:21:09] In fact, one or less, I would say, you know, there's no institution on the planet that will

[00:21:14] even lend you money if you're doing more than one.

[00:21:17] So what happens is, especially in this syndicated space, a lot of the syndicators were charging

[00:21:22] two, three, even 4%.

[00:21:24] I've seen up to 4%.

[00:21:26] So on that same deal, like I might make 300,000, but, um, that guy made almost a million.

[00:21:34] And that affects the investors how?

[00:21:37] Well, because it's all part of the raise.

[00:21:40] So, you know, so it's instead of 30, it's 31.

[00:21:44] Right.

[00:21:44] So essentially.

[00:21:46] Yeah.

[00:21:46] And basically, well, and basically what they end up doing is the investors, like more equity

[00:21:51] has to go in the deal to then pay that guy up front.

[00:21:54] And then it's getting carried in the deal.

[00:21:57] And so it just makes the overall return significantly less.

[00:22:01] And, and the likelihood of hitting the returns that you're projecting are less because typically,

[00:22:07] like if you're going to do typically a million dollar fee up front, uh, oftentimes those types

[00:22:12] of general partners will find a way to almost sneak it in to where it doesn't look like it's

[00:22:17] affecting the numbers and that, uh, you know, I mean, obviously you don't want to be doing

[00:22:22] that kind of stuff, but that's how they'll sneak it through.

[00:22:26] But those deals almost never work.

[00:22:27] They're, they're marginal deals.

[00:22:29] And those are the, those are the investors that get really upset.

[00:22:31] And the, ironically, there's a direct correlation between really high acquisition fees and bad

[00:22:38] syndicators.

[00:22:40] Yeah.

[00:22:41] Would you agree?

[00:22:42] Oh, a hundred percent.

[00:22:43] Yeah.

[00:22:43] Because I mean, look, look at here, here's the thing.

[00:22:46] If you're a really good syndicator, you want a bigger slice of the upside.

[00:22:51] You don't care about the front end fees, right?

[00:22:54] Yeah, that's exactly right.

[00:22:55] And, and honestly, like that's our sales pitch, right?

[00:22:58] Like good syndicators, their sales pitches.

[00:23:01] I don't make a dollar until I at least get you your six, seven, 8% preferred return.

[00:23:07] The acquisition fee on the front end is basically to recoup the costs of pursuit, right?

[00:23:12] Cause that, I mean, there are legitimate costs that you have going into these projects.

[00:23:16] Like, you know, I mean a $300,000 fee might sound high until you realize that that guy probably

[00:23:22] has at least an underwriter on the team.

[00:23:24] He's got probably a property management team on staff that he's got working on this deal.

[00:23:28] He's got, you know, a project manager, you know, there's a few other people that he's

[00:23:31] actually paying to go through this process.

[00:23:34] Um, and so a part of that's a little bit for profit and overhead and a part of it is actually

[00:23:38] to cover your costs.

[00:23:39] But yeah, I mean, I would much rather have my carry on the back end and say, Hey, if I

[00:23:45] hit this IRR or if I hit this return, I get a bigger portion of the upside.

[00:23:50] Uh, that way we all win together.

[00:23:53] Most investors are like, absolutely.

[00:23:54] Let's do it.

[00:23:56] Yeah.

[00:23:56] And you know, what we do is we, we actually take a piece of that and roll it right back

[00:24:00] in.

[00:24:01] We pay our operating costs for the people that help us get the deal, but then we'll just

[00:24:05] roll it right back in on the LP side.

[00:24:07] So in other words, we, we just invest it.

[00:24:10] Yeah.

[00:24:10] You invest in your deal.

[00:24:11] Yeah.

[00:24:11] Yeah.

[00:24:12] I mean, we invest in every deal anyway, but, um, uh, whereas a lot of people, a lot of

[00:24:16] syndicators were just doing it, you know, to buy cars and houses.

[00:24:21] That's another thing too, to look for, right?

[00:24:24] Like if your syndicators not investing in their own deal, that's probably a flag too.

[00:24:28] Right.

[00:24:30] One hundred percent.

[00:24:31] I mean, every LP, I mean, there's no like set, you know, everybody should do this.

[00:24:36] In my opinion, I personally would never invest with another GP that isn't investing at least

[00:24:43] the minimum ask of their investors.

[00:24:45] So if your, your minimum investment is a hundred thousand dollars and use the GP or try to tell

[00:24:50] me, Oh, I'm not putting any cash in the deal.

[00:24:52] I'm just, you know, I'm sending in the debt or I found it or I'm running it.

[00:24:55] Like, no, if you're not willing to put your money where your mouth is, I'm not doing this,

[00:24:58] man.

[00:24:59] Why do I have that?

[00:25:00] Well, we were talking to one of our investors about that today, you know, cause you know,

[00:25:05] sometimes you can't put it like you always can put the minimum, but you know, if you're

[00:25:10] investing in each one of your deals, you might not be able to do a huge amount into

[00:25:14] each deal, but you do invest money in each deal.

[00:25:17] Cause you feel confident that these deals are going to work.

[00:25:19] That's why you're putting them together.

[00:25:21] Yeah.

[00:25:22] That's, that's exactly right.

[00:25:23] Yeah.

[00:25:24] And not to, I think you said the right thing, which was, I don't really care about the acquisition

[00:25:30] fee that I'm trying to cover my overhead, you know, and I'm trying to build a company

[00:25:35] and pay everybody.

[00:25:37] Well, make sure that they're all happy.

[00:25:40] You know what I'm the, the, the, the real key is the backend.

[00:25:45] Like, like what is the property going to do?

[00:25:47] That's actually where you want to be.

[00:25:48] You want to be on the upside.

[00:25:52] That's exactly right.

[00:25:53] I mean, commercial real estate is, is a long-term game.

[00:25:56] And if you're plot, if you're trying to play it for the short term, you're going to get

[00:26:02] burned.

[00:26:03] Yeah.

[00:26:04] That's why we hold most of our staff really.

[00:26:06] But I know kiss cash out, refi cash out, refi cash out, refi cash out, refi cash out,

[00:26:12] refi cash out, refi tax free money.

[00:26:15] Right.

[00:26:17] Pay no tax, pay no tax.

[00:26:18] Well, that's actually how we acquired orchard Canyon is, you know, we sold a big project

[00:26:23] and then we rolled it into a 1031 into orchard Canyon with a couple of other investors.

[00:26:29] And that's how, you know, orchard Canyon even came to be because Ken didn't really envision

[00:26:33] himself in the hotel business.

[00:26:35] The 1031, you know, like, uh, yeah.

[00:26:38] Like if you guys are in the game long enough, you'll realize that this is really as much

[00:26:43] about saving tax, uh, legally, or you, you know, when, when you start to make a lot of

[00:26:49] money and you start to have a lot of equity and things start to roll and, and, um, you know,

[00:26:53] call it the, the, the learning between Tyler's age and my age.

[00:26:57] Well, what happens is you get to this point where you're actually thinking about tax, tax

[00:27:03] mitigation.

[00:27:03] You know, you don't want to exit all these great positions that you're in because you just

[00:27:07] pay a lot of tax with, with you refinance and, and just keep using the bank, then you

[00:27:13] can pull that money out tax-free because it's dead.

[00:27:15] It's actually not a sale.

[00:27:17] So that's the, that's the, uh, distinction there.

[00:27:20] If you sell something, the government wants their piece.

[00:27:23] If you don't, if you just keep using debt, then that, you know, then you can just keep

[00:27:29] harvesting it.

[00:27:30] So the game is, you know, uh, that's why I was like, who are you voting for?

[00:27:34] I go, well, who's, who's ever going to inflate the most because, because, you know, like

[00:27:39] who doesn't want like all our assets, you know, just continue to go up in price.

[00:27:43] Um, you know, I'm obviously being a little tongue in cheek on that, but the reality is,

[00:27:48] is that even the fed has 2% built into their model.

[00:27:52] So you know that it's at least 2%.

[00:27:54] Um, and, uh, it's obviously been a lot more than that lately, but if you just sit back and

[00:27:59] wait, cashflow manage these things well, it's, uh, it sure takes a lot of stress and

[00:28:05] anxiety off of a person.

[00:28:07] Doesn't it?

[00:28:08] Oh, that's exactly right.

[00:28:09] I mean, look, you know, especially if you pick the right markets, right?

[00:28:13] I mean, Nashville over the last 10 years, if you had just bought something and did nothing

[00:28:18] to it and you just sat there, you could have doubled or tripled, maybe even quintupled your

[00:28:22] money.

[00:28:22] Right.

[00:28:22] I mean, you know, let's just keep going because if you buy in a hot market where people are

[00:28:28] moving, things are growing, you don't necessarily have to take the risk to even develop it or

[00:28:32] to run anything.

[00:28:33] I mean, I've got, I've got, you know, bodies that are there.

[00:28:36] They're just buying land, right?

[00:28:37] They're just looking at national now going, okay, well, the path of development is going

[00:28:41] this way.

[00:28:42] You know, I'll buy, you know, uh, one mile, two miles down the road and just wait for it

[00:28:46] to catch up because, you know, from my office here, I'm over on Dickerson Pike for

[00:28:50] anybody familiar with Nashville.

[00:28:51] That's kind of on the East side.

[00:28:53] And this corridor, uh, I started telling investors and developers to buy on it, uh, back in 2018.

[00:29:01] And back then you could get land for a million dollars an acre, which every, every developer

[00:29:06] that I talked to was like, it's too early.

[00:29:08] Nobody's going to spend that for Dickerson Pike.

[00:29:11] You know, it's, it's way too early.

[00:29:13] Call me when things start happening over there.

[00:29:14] Well, it's at the base, uh, at the base of Dickerson Pike is the, the new Oracle campus,

[00:29:20] which got announced recently.

[00:29:22] Uh, we've got, you know, the new Titan stadium.

[00:29:25] Uh, we've got all sorts of development going on in the East bank.

[00:29:28] There's hundreds, if not thousands of apartment units that have now been announced up and down

[00:29:32] to Dickerson Pike and land is now worth over two and a half million dollars an acre.

[00:29:36] And five years, it went up two and a half to X.

[00:29:40] And so a lot of these investors that bought land over here to do developments.

[00:29:44] Now they're just flipping their land.

[00:29:46] Like I'm not even going to take on the risk of doing anything here.

[00:29:49] I can make a bunch of money and move on.

[00:29:50] That's, that's an excellent point.

[00:29:52] Uh, you know, it's a, you don't even have to take that next step.

[00:29:57] You just got to get in the game and kind of know, you know, where the puck is headed,

[00:30:01] right?

[00:30:02] Like, uh, as the saying goes, you want to, you want to, uh, skate to where the puck is

[00:30:07] going to be not where it is.

[00:30:10] Yeah, that's exactly right.

[00:30:12] That's exactly right.

[00:30:13] Now.

[00:30:13] I mean, there's obviously, uh, uh, some downsides to that, right?

[00:30:17] You don't get the tax benefits of, of doing, you know, improvements on these properties

[00:30:21] and, and you don't make the neighborhood better.

[00:30:23] So, I mean, that, that doesn't help.

[00:30:26] Right.

[00:30:26] Yeah.

[00:30:26] But you, you know, again, it's a mix.

[00:30:28] It's not just, you're not just in land.

[00:30:30] You're, you're in all kinds of stuff.

[00:30:32] And so, you know, maybe, maybe, you know, we, we've actually done that with land and entitled

[00:30:36] it and got it ready and sold it.

[00:30:38] We, we made $6 million on one piece of land.

[00:30:40] And what offset it was the, um, the passive income and the NOLs and net operating losses

[00:30:46] that we have from our, from our other companies and our other businesses.

[00:30:49] So, so as they start to look at you as a taxpayer and you start to look at your whole tax plan,

[00:30:55] if you just have land and you just do that, you're going to pay a lot, you know, a lot of

[00:30:59] capital gain, but if, if, if it's blended, uh, like it should be, then, then you can offset

[00:31:05] a lot of it.

[00:31:06] Yeah.

[00:31:08] I love, I love thinking how, how tax strategy created Orchard Canyon.

[00:31:13] I know.

[00:31:14] That's so cool to me.

[00:31:15] Well, I wanted to ask you about that though.

[00:31:17] So what, so maybe explain like how you find these properties to start before we jump into

[00:31:23] Orchard Canyon.

[00:31:24] Yeah.

[00:31:24] Great question.

[00:31:25] So typically, typically what I do, I mean, I'm fortunate enough to, to be asked to come

[00:31:32] speak at events and, and, and meet really cool investors, developers all across the country.

[00:31:38] So for the most part, it's, it's kind of like how Ken and I met, you know, we were, we were

[00:31:42] both speaking at Brandon Turner's event up in Denver and, you know, we happened to sit

[00:31:46] down next to each other, having lunch and set a conversation.

[00:31:50] And he said, Hey, by the way, I've got this really cool property out in Sedona that, you

[00:31:54] know, we've renovated.

[00:31:55] And it's really interesting because, you know, we, we actually own the water rights because,

[00:32:00] you know, this property was deeded before, uh, it was even a state, right?

[00:32:04] Like that, that's fascinating to me.

[00:32:06] So, so let's, let's figure that out.

[00:32:08] We have most of them, um, the handful have been in Nashville.

[00:32:12] Uh, and then I've had a handful that are, that are kind of outside of Nashville that

[00:32:15] we will actually fly to.

[00:32:16] And for the most part, it's just like, you know, looking through the urban land institutes,

[00:32:21] you know, coolest projects, uh, looking through what's trending on Instagram, things that

[00:32:27] I come across on YouTube.

[00:32:28] And I'll just reach out to the developers or investors because I think that, um, you know,

[00:32:33] the more, the more fascinating the property is, the more fascinating the story.

[00:32:37] So what did you find special about Orchard Canyon?

[00:32:40] We love it up there.

[00:32:41] We go up there a few times a year.

[00:32:43] Oh my gosh.

[00:32:44] How much time do we have on this podcast?

[00:32:47] It's almost be easier for me to answer.

[00:32:49] Like, what did I not find special about it?

[00:32:51] Uh, I mean, look at everything was amazing.

[00:32:53] Like from, from the very first moment pulling in, right.

[00:32:57] Cause you kind of, you pull off the little highway there and you cross the Creek and all

[00:33:03] of a sudden you're just like in this oasis, right?

[00:33:06] I think that was, it's, it's really neat to me how you almost have this, this mood setting

[00:33:12] coming in.

[00:33:13] It kind of prepares you.

[00:33:15] And, and as you get to the top of the hill, you come out into this, you know, it's super

[00:33:19] green with the lawn and all the beautiful trees.

[00:33:22] And, uh, as soon as we got there, we were greeted by, by two of the staff members saying,

[00:33:26] Oh, you must be Tyler.

[00:33:27] I was like, Oh yeah.

[00:33:28] Big guy with a beard must be really easy to find me.

[00:33:31] Um, but then you get there and, and you've got these really old cabins and, and I'm, I'm a

[00:33:38] sucker for old antique things just because as, as you can probably tell, I love stories,

[00:33:45] right?

[00:33:46] I want to know the stories.

[00:33:48] And, you know, when, when Ken pointed out, you know, there's like the U S forestry stamps

[00:33:54] on the logs in the cabin, because these things are like over a hundred years old, you know,

[00:33:59] I find that to be so neat.

[00:34:01] Um, you know, being able to, to walk down to the apple orchard in the morning and, and

[00:34:09] I mean, to me coming from the Eastern side of the U S and you know, like I don't equate

[00:34:15] an apple orchard in the shadow of these like red rock mountains.

[00:34:21] Like that was the wildest contrast to me.

[00:34:25] Um, and then of course, you know, the amazing food, the, the even better company.

[00:34:30] Uh, I mean, I honestly can't, can't say enough good things.

[00:34:33] I thought it was, I thought it was outstanding.

[00:34:35] That thought.

[00:34:36] So it was really fun having you, you guys went and, uh, wait, off-roaded in a Tom car.

[00:34:41] The Tom car out, man.

[00:34:42] Like, Oh my gosh.

[00:34:44] A little bit.

[00:34:44] I mean, well, first of all, I don't do the Tom car.

[00:34:47] I know.

[00:34:47] It's all rough for me.

[00:34:49] I mean, Tyler, you, you came out to work.

[00:34:51] I mean, when you're out here, you know, you, you like, you like you work.

[00:34:55] It's, it's not, I mean, you got the camera guys and you know, you got all the interviews

[00:34:59] and there's a lot of setup and there's a lot of stuff happening.

[00:35:02] So just trying to find a break for you, you know, you stuck out real early before breakfast.

[00:35:09] Yeah.

[00:35:10] Yeah.

[00:35:10] It was, it was great.

[00:35:11] I mean, here's the thing.

[00:35:13] Like I, it's, it's tough for me to enjoy those moments with the camera off.

[00:35:20] Cause I'm like, Oh my gosh, but this is going to be so cool for us to show.

[00:35:23] Like, imagine being able to show the behind the scenes of this.

[00:35:26] And you know, these conversations that we had, I mean, there were obviously some moments

[00:35:30] like, like at dinner, right.

[00:35:31] Where we didn't have any cameras out and it's, it's, Hey, let's, let's turn everything

[00:35:34] off.

[00:35:35] And, and that's, uh, you know, just part of the stuff that we'll keep to ourselves.

[00:35:39] So we had some amazing conversations over dinner, dude, the, the Tom car was the wildest experience

[00:35:45] I've ever had.

[00:35:46] I can't wait for you guys to see the video.

[00:35:49] Uh, you know, Ken basically got me to go down this like unbelievably steep hill.

[00:35:55] There's no way any normal car would do this.

[00:35:58] Uh, it, it definitely scared the hell out of me a little bit.

[00:36:01] Um, but Ken, I've been asked a couple of times, uh, you know, cause obviously I had posted

[00:36:06] on Instagram that I was hanging out with you that weekend and a bunch of people had reached

[00:36:09] out and they were like, Oh my gosh, what was it like hanging out with Ken?

[00:36:13] And I was like, you know what?

[00:36:14] I'll tell, I'll tell you this story.

[00:36:15] This, this to me completely encapsulates who Ken is as a, as a person.

[00:36:20] We were, we were driving the Tom car around and, and I had just taken it over and you

[00:36:25] know, this thing's, yeah, it's a very, very nice vehicle.

[00:36:29] And we come around this turn and we start going up the hill and we just hear this super

[00:36:34] loud pop because the, the bottom had hit this massive rock.

[00:36:39] And so I kind of slammed on the brakes and I looked over at Ken.

[00:36:41] I'm like, I'm so sorry, man.

[00:36:43] I think I just broke your Tom car.

[00:36:45] And Ken looks at me and goes, no, man, it's fine.

[00:36:48] If you did, it'd be a blessing.

[00:36:49] And I was like, wow, that's a really cool way to handle a potentially stressful situation.

[00:36:56] What a, what a graceful way to, to handle that.

[00:36:59] So that was, that was a lot of fun, man.

[00:37:01] And I got to give you props, Ken.

[00:37:02] I don't know that I would have been as happy about breaking a Tom car as you were.

[00:37:07] The first 30 seconds.

[00:37:11] That's right.

[00:37:13] No, you guys had fun and you, you guys said you ran into a guy on the trail.

[00:37:18] Do you want to talk about that?

[00:37:20] Oh my gosh.

[00:37:21] Yeah.

[00:37:21] The team, this was your buddy from college, right?

[00:37:23] Yeah.

[00:37:24] Yeah.

[00:37:24] Yeah.

[00:37:26] We're in Sedona.

[00:37:27] So Sedona does have some character.

[00:37:29] First of all, let's, let's put some context around that.

[00:37:31] We, we, we, we went quite a ways off road into the back country and we were up on this Mesa

[00:37:38] looking down probably, you know, I don't know, at least 500 to a thousand feet down, um, with

[00:37:45] these beautiful towering red rocks all around us.

[00:37:48] And all of a sudden four women and a dude with a, with a, with a rice paddy hat, uh, come

[00:37:56] walking out up onto the thing to do yoga.

[00:37:59] It's like six 30 in the morning or something.

[00:38:01] Right.

[00:38:02] Yeah.

[00:38:03] It was so early.

[00:38:04] It's something right, left right out of like a Deepak Chopra book.

[00:38:08] Um, and we just looked at each other.

[00:38:10] Like, where did you come from?

[00:38:12] Cause we're out there.

[00:38:13] What did he say?

[00:38:13] I can't remember, but it was, I, it was something about Nashville.

[00:38:17] Like I said, I was from Nashville and he had some like loaded up comment about Nashville

[00:38:22] and Oh, he was like, you know, the red rocks here are the music in Nashville.

[00:38:28] It's the same.

[00:38:29] It was like something where we were just, and of course, all the ladies go, ah, you

[00:38:35] know, and we all like go do that.

[00:38:38] So for every major city in the U S 100%.

[00:38:43] He was, he was way too quick with it.

[00:38:45] Like that guy has practiced this.

[00:38:47] Like that's how he picks up those women.

[00:38:49] I swear.

[00:38:50] If this guy ever gets a documentary on him, Will Ferrell is playing the character.

[00:38:54] Oh, for sure.

[00:38:55] We, I mean, if you, all you do is a GoPro on that guy and that would go viral.

[00:39:00] That's so funny.

[00:39:01] It was amazing.

[00:39:03] Yeah.

[00:39:04] So Tyler, wait, when you do these documentaries, like do you, are you digging into the different

[00:39:09] businesses and the cashflow that they have and different things like that?

[00:39:13] That's exactly right.

[00:39:15] Yeah.

[00:39:15] So, so that is one piece that I ask the investor or the developer about on the fraud end, because

[00:39:22] we probably won't do it unless it's just an outstanding story.

[00:39:26] If you're not willing to share the financials, because in my opinion, it is, it is just as

[00:39:34] important to learn from the failures as it is the successes.

[00:39:38] And all of these deals have been successful, right?

[00:39:43] They just may not have been as successful as the investor had initially intended, or, you

[00:39:48] know, maybe they're significantly more successful.

[00:39:50] And sometimes people get more, they get scared about sharing those financials.

[00:39:54] But to me, you don't really learn anything.

[00:39:58] If you don't learn like how much did it cost?

[00:40:01] What was the biggest expense that popped up that you didn't budget for?

[00:40:05] How did you handle that?

[00:40:07] Like, those are some of the most important parts of the conversation.

[00:40:10] And so that, yeah, I mean, that's, that's a big piece of it.

[00:40:13] We dive into, you know, how did you find it?

[00:40:16] How did you build the relationships?

[00:40:17] What were the, what were the negotiations like?

[00:40:19] I mean, you know, Ken, how long do we sit there an hour, two hours for this interview?

[00:40:23] Like it's a, it's an intense interview.

[00:40:25] Yeah.

[00:40:25] Yeah.

[00:40:25] It's very, very well done.

[00:40:27] It's a, I mean, it's a excellent question.

[00:40:31] Yeah.

[00:40:31] And I appreciate that because sometimes, you know, we even get guests on that we interview

[00:40:34] and they're very evasive.

[00:40:35] Right.

[00:40:36] And I, I understand, like, I understand always not wanting to be upfront, but when you're

[00:40:39] evasive, then like nobody learns anything.

[00:40:42] Right.

[00:40:42] Like, you know, cause we've all messed up.

[00:40:44] We've all made mistakes.

[00:40:44] We've all lost money.

[00:40:46] And so, you know, I appreciate that when you interview someone, you make them kind of palms

[00:40:51] up on everything because that's the only way the other people are going to learn from it.

[00:40:56] Yeah, that's right.

[00:40:57] And, and, you know, look, I mean, I'm, I'm willing to be the first person in the room to

[00:41:00] be like, look, I lost a million dollars on one deal.

[00:41:03] Right.

[00:41:04] Like, you know.

[00:41:06] Let's have a conversation about it.

[00:41:07] Let's talk about it because maybe somebody can learn from my experience and never have

[00:41:12] that same thing happen to them.

[00:41:14] And I'm totally fine with that.

[00:41:15] Right.

[00:41:15] Like we went and made the money back.

[00:41:16] It's just a million dollars.

[00:41:18] But at the end of the day, I think it's important to have those conversations.

[00:41:21] Like we don't need to be guarded about it.

[00:41:23] And in fact, like I will encourage anybody listening to this.

[00:41:27] If you've ever lost money on a deal, put the story together, go share it.

[00:41:30] Because I'll be honest with you.

[00:41:32] Like when I, when I started telling investors, like, yes, because that's one of the questions

[00:41:37] I always get.

[00:41:37] Have you ever lost money on a deal?

[00:41:39] Yes.

[00:41:39] I lost a million dollars.

[00:41:41] Here's exactly what happened.

[00:41:42] Here's how I handled it.

[00:41:43] But they'll almost always still give me the money.

[00:41:47] Right.

[00:41:47] Because now they know if they get into that situation, Tyler's going to handle it.

[00:41:52] It's funny.

[00:41:53] So they get supported to be vulnerable.

[00:41:54] You know, that limitless event I do every year with Terrell.

[00:41:58] So we got hacked during like, uh, like two weeks before, um, literally, uh, almost $500,000.

[00:42:05] And, um, uh, you know, we ended up clawing some of it back, but we still lost, uh, you

[00:42:10] know, uh, almost 300.

[00:42:11] But the point is this right after it happened, I go to Tarl, I go, let's, let's film this.

[00:42:19] Let's tell everybody.

[00:42:20] Let's, let's get up.

[00:42:22] So we, we went up and, uh, up in front of my mastermind, the collective, which we had.

[00:42:26] And I said, we just sat with two chairs and said, and walked through the whole story just

[00:42:31] so everybody in the audience could hear what happened to us, you know, just so they wouldn't.

[00:42:37] And so everybody's like, thank you so much for telling us the story.

[00:42:40] We had no idea.

[00:42:41] I mean, these people went to lengths and setting up domains and doing zoom calls and doing AI

[00:42:47] with, uh, you know, with, with the voice of, uh, of, of some of the staff and stuff.

[00:42:51] I got, it was a, you know, it was an orchestrated thing that there was weeks, but the

[00:42:56] point is that just because we were, we were both like, yeah, man, let's see.

[00:43:00] He's an EO of course, and actually in Austin and, um, and, and, and he's like, yeah, that'd

[00:43:06] be great.

[00:43:07] So we did it.

[00:43:08] And, and actually we're going to do a little clip on it too, just to teach.

[00:43:12] Like people don't realize that that is kind of the point.

[00:43:15] It's not a, it's not an embarrassment.

[00:43:17] Yeah.

[00:43:18] Well, uh, and that's wonderful, right?

[00:43:20] Cause it's only a failure.

[00:43:21] If you don't take anything away from it, the fact that you're going out like, yeah.

[00:43:25] Okay.

[00:43:25] You spent a few hundred thousand dollars learning what it's like to get hacked.

[00:43:28] Now you can make sure that that never happens to you.

[00:43:30] Cause I mean, here's the thing.

[00:43:32] It didn't happen for 3 million and now hopefully it won't ever, right?

[00:43:36] Like you learned the lesson.

[00:43:38] Let's protect more.

[00:43:39] I immediately called my CFO and I sat down with my partner and I go, listen, this happened

[00:43:43] to me and this is how they did it.

[00:43:44] And immediately we took things into action, you know, on my, on my company.

[00:43:49] And so to your point, I, I, I looked at it as a $300,000 lesson and you know, that,

[00:43:56] that shored up a lot of things that I didn't understand.

[00:43:59] Yeah.

[00:44:00] It's, it's so important to have takeaways for things like that, because I mean, at the

[00:44:04] end of the day, uh, I mean, the amount of money that I've spent on lessons like that,

[00:44:09] you might as well get something out of it.

[00:44:10] And if it's just a story, I'll take it.

[00:44:12] These guys do a great job on their documentaries.

[00:44:14] This is going to be awesome.

[00:44:16] We're so excited to see it.

[00:44:17] Tyler, where can everyone go watch this video on YouTube?

[00:44:21] Thank you so much.

[00:44:22] Yeah.

[00:44:22] It's, it's, uh, you can find it on YouTube either under my name, Tyler Cobble.

[00:44:28] Uh, hopefully we'll be able to provide you all with the link this week before it goes

[00:44:31] live.

[00:44:32] So it can be in the show.

[00:44:33] BLE, by the way, Tyler CAUBLE.

[00:44:36] That's right.

[00:44:36] Yep.

[00:44:42] Spaces in between the words.

[00:44:44] Um, yeah, that's where you can find it.

[00:44:46] You guys check it out.

[00:44:47] And also if you're interested in checking out Orchard Canyon, just go to enjoyorchardcanyon.com

[00:44:53] and you can see, uh, photos of the resort.

[00:44:57] Highly recommend that you do that, by the way.

[00:44:59] This, I'm obviously not getting paid to plug Orchard Canyon, but if you want to do a retreat,

[00:45:04] it has got to be hands down the, one of the best places in the United States.

[00:45:08] If you have like a 20 to 30 person retreat, uh, and also, uh, take your girlfriend, take

[00:45:14] your wife.

[00:45:15] Uh, don't love it.

[00:45:16] Ken and I got married there.

[00:45:17] So that's how much.

[00:45:18] Did you really?

[00:45:19] Yeah.

[00:45:19] It's beautiful.

[00:45:20] That's awesome.

[00:45:21] Yeah.

[00:45:21] I don't blame you.

[00:45:23] Hey, any final words?

[00:45:25] Oh man.

[00:45:25] You know, the, the only final word that I'll say is, is just get out there, uh, do your

[00:45:30] due diligence and do it right.

[00:45:32] I mean, put, put the work in it.

[00:45:33] Commercial real estate isn't easy, but it is simple when you get out there and you

[00:45:37] surround yourself with the right people.

[00:45:39] If you're listening to Ken's show, you've already put yourself in one of the right rooms.

[00:45:43] So what are the other four?

[00:45:46] Hi, always great connecting, man.

[00:45:48] I can't wait to see you next time I'm out in Nashville.

[00:45:50] And if you're out here, please let, let us know.

[00:45:54] Yeah.

[00:45:54] I'll have to bring one out there.

[00:45:55] It'll be a good time.

[00:45:56] And Daniel, thank you guys.

[00:45:57] Let's go.

[00:45:58] Yeah.

[00:45:59] It'd be so much fun.

[00:46:00] Appreciate you guys.

[00:46:01] Okay, man.

[00:46:02] Cheers.

[00:46:03] Cheers.

[00:46:03] Cheers.

[00:46:03] .