Hidden Real Estate Niches That Are Thriving in 2024: Insights Brandon Turner

Welcome to the Real Estate Strategies Podcast. Let's get right into this episode. Hey, everybody's Ken McRoy here, and I'm here with my good buddy Brandon Turner. Everybody knows Brandon. Welcome back to the show. Ken. Thank you so much. I was so jazzed to get the invite to come on and talk to you. I always walk away smarter after talking to you, so thank you. Oh it's so good. I know we got a great history. I really enjoyed coming to your Better Life Tribe of An in Denver and that was a blast. Thanks for having me for that, and thank you. Congrats on the success, sir. One of the things I wanted to talk about today with you is you had some really good posts about real estate niches that are absolutely crushing it in twenty twenty four. I really think it's important that we focus on that now because there's a lot of doom and gloom and there's a lot of clickbait stuff all over YouTube. I would rather just focus on what is working. And I know before this we talked about there's actually more. There's quite a fit you actually and there's a lot of little niche I think you call them fringe real estate investments. Let's start talking about that. And you know, because there's a lot of people making a lot of money right now and that aren't yeah doing single family. That art syndicating, you know, right, Yeah, And in fact, you brought this up. You mentioned a point in one of your talks at the Better Life Summit that we did where you mentioned like you were saying like, hey, the cycle looks like this, and then you pause and you said something like, well, keep in mind, I'm talking about multifamily. Every asset class has kind of a different cycle and they don't always flow together. And I remember that just being such a solid point, because yeah, it's easy to go on a TikTok video or an instance video and be like real estate is bad right now, and then everyone's like, oh, yeah, that's bad. But the reality is things always work, Something always works somewhere, like it is something to live. So it's true. Well, you know, we've been buying in just as an example. I know we're going to go all over the place with this, but we've been buying in Assistant Care fifty five for at least ten years. And I know I didn't know I wear in that I own a lot of them. Yeah, but I've stayed in the active so people might not know there's active senior, and then there's you know, more of the people that need us more assistant care, and then there's actually congreg get care. Ye. Then there's many levels here. They could do all real estate based. So you know, this senior tsunami if you call it, I guess these people retiring. Was it like eleven thousand people a day are actually exiting the workforce and retiring. So let's just focus here for a minute. I know this is an area you've been focusing on as well. Right, Yeah, we're we're just dipping our toes in right now into playing with the assisted living space. And again, I also like the kind of active senior space. I don't want to run a nursing home per se, Like I don't want to handle nurses and twenty four hour staff necessarily. Maybe, I mean, there's a world there. There's definitely money we made there, but I I mean, there's one of my favorite quotes, Dwayne Gretzky says something along the lines of I'm successful because I know how to skate to where the puck is going, not to where the puck is right so when I look at the American puck like, what where is it going, It's like it's going to a lot of old people, the senior tsunami you mentioned, So getting in front of those people, uh, trying to find housing for them, which there's not enough of, huge, huge opportunity there. You'll love this. One of our one of our senior properties is it's two hundred units. It's last year I looked, we had forty two people move move out the whole year. Like that's just incredible, right, And so you start to look at why, right, you know, because you know when somebody moves into a senior project and this is odd because turnover is not a thing, and a senior project oddly enough, you know. And so there's there's usually medical reasons or you know, some others that that would make that move. But it's also think about they don't necessarily have jobs, so you're getting into their bank accounts and their you know, their financial accounts and stuff like that. But here's the thing. They stay for years. And so once you lease up a project like that, it is incredible obviously very they don't abuse it. They don't move in and out. You know, there's a lot of partying, not a lot of kids and partying and drinking and right right, So so we've been focusing on these it's been fantastic. The flip side of it is is that there's oftentimes they have income restrictions from and this is the horrible thing. This is why I love our financial education stuff that we're preaching because like my mom, my dad passed away, and my mom has a fixed income and inflation's crushing her. Right, So obviously it's my mom. But so now we've got Now I'm in the space and I see that there's a lot of seniors that are that are restricted. They're they're they're not they don't they don't have room for six eight nine percent inflation, you know what I mean. Yeah, it's really hurting them. And uh yeah, I say it with my parents as well, like my Yeah, it's it's rough. And so if we can be part of the solution, which is also it's fun to be in that in that niche And one of one thing I'm excited about being in it is because you can solve not only a real financial problem for your investors, but like you know how to how to make money, but you're like solving a real problem, and like, like there's elderly people who just can't afford to live, and you're providing a real asset. You can manage better than other people because there's a lot of mismanagement in the senior care world. So you can take care of people, take care of other people's moms and dads, like I just I feel a lot better about Like I feel good about owning an athlet class like that. Yeah, And I think a lot of people there's a misconception too. A lot of people think of that old, big institution that looks like a school, yeah, with nurse ratchet, you know, over there. And I think, you know what's different now is I was I was having dinner last night with a friend of mine. He's been buying these kind of mega mansions because people moving, they're getting away from those, you know, like the like the big houses. Like even me, like I've had a big house for all you well you just like you you know, after a while, you're like, holy crap, these houses I have are just too big. And there's you know, it's just me and my wife. So but anyway, he's been buying those and then he's been he converts the garages, and he converts some of the common space, and he'll have you know, six, seven, eight bedrooms in there and to put a chef in and a nurse and uh you know, and they rent, uh, you know, for about the same price. But each bedroom can be you know, four or five thousand a month. And so when you start to have let's say eight of those, you know, one little house can be thirty forty thousand dollars a month. Yeah, so these could be really interesting, nice little assets, right. Yeah, we're we're looking at one right now. It's similar. I think it's an eight bedroom house. And uh again, we're just dipping our toes in here. And he was will be our first actually like or partner with a dude who does this. He's got a now seventy or eighty of them right now. But there are these little these yeah, I think there's eight bedrooms in it. Yeah, but the cash on cash return that we're expecting is somewhere in like the forty five percent range. Cash on cash, Yeah, forty five percent. It's like, well, shoot, I can do now. The problem is they're small. It's hard for guys like us to scale that kind of thing. Up into you know, millions of million dollar We're talking about two hundred thusand dollars property, three hundre thousand dollars property. But you know, like, I'm okay doing smaller deals, significantly smaller deals if I can get that kind of return and we just find a way to make that growth. So yeah, I love that. I love that Limitless is coming up. I'm so excited. Yeah, it's August twenty ninth, thirtieth, and thirty first at the Gaylord in Dallas, Texas at Limitlessexpo dot com. It is going to be a great, great event. I cannot wait. It's going to be the end of August twenty nine, thirty thirty first at the Gaylord Palms in Dallas, Texas at www dot Limitless Expo dot com. It's sold out the last two years. We expect thousands of people. As you guys know, this is an event that you do not want to miss. We have over fifty speakers, we have over eighty booths and presenters and sponsors, and this is an event. If you guys are even uncertain a little bit about what the future of the economy is, this is something that you're definitely not gonna want to miss. And for those of you might be on the fence or just want to see what this is all about, just check the free webinar that we're going to do on June twenty fifth, and you can find the link below. Silly and they can't click on the label below they're listening to a podcast, so they need to go to www dot go dot limitless, xbo dot com, last join a to check out the details and sign up for the free webinar. That's www dot go dot limitless expo dot com, last stoin a. If that's too much for you to remember, and you can check out the show notes and you will see it there. And the point is here, guys, is that this is a niche that's coming, regardless if you're ready or not. When you got ten eleven thousand people moving or actually retiring each day, yeah, and you know it's just gonna it's gonna continue to move that way. And I know this we kind of are rolling into you know, let's let's in your last post you talked about this mobile home parks. Now I know I've done them, You're doing them on much bigger scale. The this is a this is a niche that used to be super mom and pop. Yeah, and now it's blowing out, Like obviously I start to see mobile home parks by you know, cbre and Katie H like okay, cats out of the bag now, right, But yeah, it's gotten incredibly complicated. I mean, cap rates were lower on mobile home parks for a while than they were on apartment complexes. Like they were it was just it was it's it's still is. It's incredibly difficult to find the big ones because now I'm competing with the hedge funds. But there's something really interesting in the like the mid size mobile home which are I mean I'm not looking anything under one hundred units right now because they're just too small for me. So there's a huge opportunity, especially for you know, newer or younger investors, to look in that like mid size space that are still mom and pop and that are just mismanaged and that are yeah, they are just they're affordable right now. You can get a good cash and cash return if you're willing to put into work to manage one, which is a bit of work. And I think the reason is obviously is back to affordability, right. Yeah, So so you know, there's a couple of ways to skin this cat, as you guys know. But typically a mobile home is significantly less in red than than a hole, right yep. And then in some cases you could that you find people actually bring them in and you just charge them, you know, a pad ret like, yeah, that's what we try to do entirely. I mean we end up with them anyway. But like you know, when you have seven thousand lots, like we end up with a lot of homes, but we don't want them because I don't like to fix things, right right, So so but again that what's is affordability, and as you know, and so where do you think that's heading? Where do you think affordability is heading? Where do you think it? You know, I'm seeing we've got a little bit of soft ut here for the next say eighteen months, but after that, it sure looks to me like it's going to take a run again. It looks like it's going to be a Yeah, it's going to be a real problem. I think I don't see a world that the government doesn't get involved heavily, right like, because I mean at the end of the day, like when things when it does run up again, like I looked at your data. I think you're a spot on. I think like they just did not build enough housing. They have not built enough. They still don't have enough in most of America. And so what if that mean it means prices go up. Well, when prices go up and rents go up and people can't they claim they can't afford it. Yeah, they're gonna yell to the politicians. The politicians are going to try to enact rent control, They're going to enact a bunch of other things. So I don't see anyway around that. Even even in red states, I think we're going to start seeing more government involvement. And I don't think that's a bad thing for investors. I think whenever the government gets involved, investors tend to actually win, and it tends to hurt people long term. And we need some I mean, think about it. The government's been of all a long time. You know, think of welfare, Section eight, you know, think of tax credits. So they've always kind of bounced around real estate because they're just not very good at it. Like they they need they need people like us provide housing. And and I think you know, if you just think whatever the word wherever you use the word public housing, there's a bad you know, you think bad, right, and there's a reason they're just not good at it. But they're good at, you know, working with local developers and providing in it. And that's really what's needed. We're millions of units under supplied, yep, yep. And I think that's where we see, like we see California making some progress on this, which is a phrase I never thought I would sail out. It's like the California government's making some progress with the EIGHTYU stuff right now. They see one of the solutions to the problem of affordability is let's let every and Hawhi has been doing this for one hundred years, Like every single house out here has an ADU and accessory dwelling unit. You know, we call them mohanas. I know in your area you call them casitas, whatever you call them. They are these extra standalone units. And so that California says, okay, well, let's let everybody build one. Pretty much across the board, if you want one, you can kind of build one. And the beauty of that is one you provide you you provide more housing stock, which is good. You reduce them like the higher price point for the house. Now, can you know a homeowner can basically house hack by having an ADU or two on their property, which can reduce the rent. And so slowly California seems to be coming along around to it. I think all other states will all follow course eventually. So we're going to see ADUs across Texas, you know, Dallas, Austin, it's a craze. A sky sale just passed it. Oh did they Okay, Yeah, it's coming. It's it's a it's coming across everywhere. And so I think there's tremendous opportunity right now to be an expert in that space because there's just not a lot of experts in that space right now. So let's let's talk about that, because I completely agree with you because I have you know, there's a lot of land like in Scottsdale that's one acre, like one house per acre. That is a tremendous amount of land. You won't find that in Hawaii or California. So the ability to be able to build an ADU, you know, back in the corner, let's say of that. And by the way, you don't need an acre, you need way less. Yeah, What it does is you could scoop some you could scoop some equity out of your home through even a he lock yep and just build that and now you have some passive income directly. Right. I think there's a real interesting model that I have not seen, and maybe it exists. I'm sure it exists because there's smart people out there in which, you know, selling shovels instead of digging for gold. Right where, I think there's an opportunity for some smart business people to look at financing for ADUs and maybe even a way to finance them and then manage the rental. So imagine you're a homeowner and you need two hundred and fifty thousand dollars build an ADU. Well, what can I come in and finance the two fifty But then I'm gonna take a cut of that rent for the next twenty years, maybe not all the rent, but maybe a cut of it. So the homeowner gets an increased value of their property, they get some cash flow coming in with no money out of pocket, and then I get the rest for placing a tenant managing There's something magical there. I think that that we're gonna start seeing large corporations come in and just I mean, that's what corporations do, right. They take a strategy that everyone's mom and popping right now? Mom and popping is that a new word? They're a mom and popping it. And then they're going to systematize it and scale it. And I think there's an opportunity. There's billions to be made in that world right now. Yeah, yeah, this is a big change across the country. I think you're right, it's going to roll out the ADU craze. And I know if That's does a great job of that up in Stle too, he's got a whole bunch of business around that. Yeah. I think you can take a mediocre deal, like let's say you want to flip a house. You can take a house that's e I don't know if I can make a lot of money from this, but all of a sudden, you toss on a two hundred and fifty thousand dollars ADU that you can rent for four thousand dollars a month. And also in that property, now now you have a way to make money on a property that you didn't have before. And so as this rolls out, a tremendous opportunity for people. By the way, all roads are leading to affordability issues. Guys, I don't really Yeah, you'll see the theme here. Yeah. So let's another one that you mentioned was rent by the room. This is starting to pop up everywhere, right, So what do you what are you seeing? Yeah? I mean this is probably my number one favorite newbie strategy. Like, if you're new to real estate, my number one favorite strategy right now would be rent by the room because I just especially if you're in an expensive area. Often you know, you're in California, You're why you're in New York, you're somewhere ato, Seattle. Because the affordability, we just keep coming back to it. You can't afford I mean, somebody making sixteen dollars an hour working at Starbucks can't afford twenty two hundred dollars a month for their studio apartment, and so they'd rather pay twelve hundred a month to live with other people. And at the same time as we have the affordability problem, we also have like the what I would call like the religion gap or the real religion and vacuum. What I mean by that is humans crave connection in community and they for thousands of years we have gotten connection in community, largely through religion. Well as religion goes away in America, and it has largely gone away to the young population. I mean, like majority of vast majority of young people no longer attend any kind of religious services. Where do they get their community? So the pad split idea or the rent by the room co living, however you want to call it, is interesting that solves two problems affordability and community in one shot. So it's not a negative to go live in a house with five other people you don't know. It actually is a positive for people to go live in a house with five other people they don't actually know. And I think that's super interesting. Yeah, my sister's been ahead of this for some time. I don't know if you ever met her, but she she was a bookkeeper, so she never went to college. She was a bookkeeper at a medical company. And actually I grew up in Everett, Washington. It was at the ever Clinic. So she made a modest salaries find her husband worked at Kimberly Clark, which is a big, big factory in town. But the point is is she bought a house and Everett she started renting it by the room. She did know what she was doing, and she I asked her, how's it going. She's like, it's great. I'm red teak to basically business people that have to come to Everett, and they got their own closet. Sometimes they have their own bathroom. Sometimes they don't. But they're just here maybe once a week, maybe once every two weeks. Maybe they come for you know, three or four days a week, whatever it is. But they just don't want to live out of a hotel and they don't want to be in the airbnb. So there's a massive niche there anyway. So she took that one and rolled to another one, and rolled it to another one, and rolled it to another one. Now she's got a massive real estate portfolio. That's awesome, all from just literally, you know, being very good at a county, at a medical place. I love hearing that. I mean, my very first house ever I bought when I was twenty almost twenty one. I was just before my twenty first birthday. I bought a house, a single family house, rented out the bedrooms to other guys, and I got to live for and that was my entrance into real estate. It just made sense. If you look in Europe, Australia, Asia, they've been doing rent by the room for years, as Americans have always had this kind of like our nose turned up a little bit to it, like oh I'm, I'm we're not we're independent here, we don't need that here. And I think that era is ending, and so as it becomes more and more normalized, that's going to be a huge So a huge piece of the affordability is we're just going to have to increase the I guess you call it density within a house. Now, a lot of areas still have the kind of these old laws around the number of unrelated people that can live in a certain house and the amount of parking that you might need for some of those stuff. And so, like you know, cities are kind of either a working through that or investors are just ignoring it and hoping they don't get caught. And I'm not saying you should or shouldn't, but I'm seeing a lot of that right now. Yeah, we see that too. It's those are there are occupancy standards in some areas, so you do have to look and of course the parking, as you mentioned, and I think there's also fire and you know accessibility and eighty A and you American Disability Act. A great buddy of mine's son moved in. He's in the Air Force up in Spokane up there, US in the and he bought a four bedroom house and rended three of the others to some of those Air Force buddies. And yeah, and you know, he came over, I go, how's it going to He's like, I'm cash flowing and I'm and I'm living rent free. Yeah, in't that wild model. There's a buddy of mine actually an alteration on this one that I think is going to be big in the coming years, and that is rent by the build to rent by the room. And so I got a buddy doing it right now. He's building a number of these houses. And when you can design the house from the beginning, knowing you're going to rent by the roommate, you can do some really interesting things like you can build space for kitchenettes and every single unit, you can build a bathroom for every single unit. You can build like steer your doors for every single unit. But it's still one house. So when you can envision from the from the beginning, what would be the most cash flow possible property that I could build. I mean, it doesn't take that much more money because either a simple generally simple houses to build an eight bedroom, eight bath, and it probably does a four bedroom, three bath that you would build for a normal family. And so just the way you build that, the way you can figure it can produce a math amount of return and cash flow, especially right now. Yeah, by the way, this used to be called student housing. Yeah, that really is because I had the laugh because exactly, you know, there's exactly what I have up in the Flagstaff and NAU. You know, there's a big common kitchen, and then there's you could lock off, so you could actually have a vacant unit just locked off. So my maybe's five bedroom or four bedroom and three are occupied in that one space. Y'all come through one center door and you got the common area, but the others are just locked off. It's actually literally the way we used to build our old student housing. That's so funny. Yeah, it's exactly what is that student housing for people who are older than a student house. I know, I tell you it's it's but again we're going back to affordability because to your point, you know, if you're at sixteen or twenty dollars an hour. You can't afford the rents, And I don't see I don't see rents slowing down maybe for a year, year and a half, but after that they're gonna they're gonna go crazy again because lack of supply. Yeah, yeah, you know living out here in Hawaii, where you know, the medium house price is now higher than a million dollars in my area on the entire island of Maui. But there's I think people forget this off and is like there's still like I think it's seventy five thousand people who live here on the island that are just normal people who just work, and a lot of them make twenty bucks an hour. So it's a really interesting analysis or use case for the rest of the country where we're getting to, which is really expensive housing that normal people with normal incomes have to be able to afford. And so what do we see out here? Eighty us are super popular. Rent by the room has been super popular for decades here. I mean the number of friends I have that just rent like it's actually a buddy mine yesterday he's paying three thousand dollars a month to rent a master bedroom, like a primary bedroom in a house. He's paying three thousand dollars a month to rent that, but have the separate interest on the side, And so it works for people out here. I mean, it's it's not the American dream, so to speak, where you get your you know, five acres and a nice big mansion, but it works, and it's it's spreading across the country, and it sure looks to me like it's not gonna stop anytime soon, you know. I know you and I've talked a lot about this, but it does look to me like we're actually heading more and more toward a rentered nation like never before. Because there's always been kind of a balance, you know, whole ownership, home ownership, home ownership, and people have been able to do that. But now we've got these high single family prices and these high interest rates as well. You know, and you know, before before we got on here, you said, you know, you think kind of the single family craze is over. Can you talk a little bit about more that. Yeah, I mean when you yeah, when you're paying seven and a half percent for interest, and it does seem to be coming down slowly right now, as you know, this week, and I've seen a few decent rates, but you know, when you're paying seven percent for house that's already overinflated in terms of price, like, it's really really hard unless you're buying, like, you know, maybe a rough part of Cleveland, Ohio or Lincoln, Nebraska. Unless you're like in those markets, it's really hard to get cash flow out of anything single family. And so I think it's interesting that that, you know, all the hedge funds and all the big Wall Street companies that are in there still buying single family houses. You know, I think they're they're betting on appreciation and appreciation for single family houses. I think it's still there. I think long term, like we've talked about, affordability is a problem, but there's no real solution right now other than just we're gonna see prices go up. And so I think everyone's just betting on appreciation right now, which is fine. If you've got billions of dollars in the bank, why not bet on appreciation. But for cash flow, I don't see single family houses anytime soon becoming viable. And the other thing is, you know, these are really really great ideas. I also think people should be really aware of the laws in their area, like yeah, state or their city, like never before was I we always knew that California was rent control. We always knew it was a little bit in New York here and there, and I guess the organ passed it not long ago. But now we're starting to see rate caps. We're starting to see a lot of talk from tenant unions because the tenants are blaming uh, landlords and and they're not really looking at the reasons why we can't because we want to build. That's the business we're in, right, Yeah, yeah, I Uh, I lost one thousand Instagram followers the other day because I said, uh, I said, maybe the afford or maybe that what I said. Liberals love to complain that landlords are causing the housing crisis, but maybe the problem is they're not allowing building, but letting millions of people into our country. And uh, people did not like that. Uh they didn't. They didn't like that logic of supply and demand. So I lost a lot of people that day. I'm all for immigration too. It's just like, if we're not going to build, and we're not gonna allow building, and we're going to charge a tremendous amount of money to get permits and to get anything done. You know, we're got a problem. We can be assured to one thing, no matter are where you stand on the issue. More people taking more housing makes everything else more expensive. Yeah, it's it's it's math, it's science. It's just it's the fact of life of how that works. And so the government that goes back to the they're going to try to force it in other ways to not work that way. Rather than solving the problem, I think the government is just gonna be like, well, all right, well we're gonna no more rent increases. And then, of course we all know that just causes problems in itself, like why would I go fix up my property if i'm if I can't rent it for more money. So it just creates a whole other world of issues. But the reality is that the politician doesn't really understand the impact. Right, they see the people coming across the border, let's say, but it appacks everything and it packs, you know, think about every single thing that those folks need. It packs all of those industries, and typically housing shows up unfortunately, and and and then you add on which we casually touched on the institutions are buying up single fabily did you would you ever imagine that you'd be uh actually bidding against you know, black Rock or Amazon for bezos for a house. Yeah, it's it's insane, but it makes it makes sense because they're all out there looking for a return, they're all there looking for growth and that you know, the cats out of the bag. Real estate's actually pretty decent, and so I know, I know it's interesting. So so let's talk about another one that you talked about in your in your post, which was campground. So yeah, big Koa, I think you put so I love this play because again going back to the you know, the Wayne Gretzky quote, if you have ten eleven thousand people retiring and they've been working their butts off and they are buying r vs, they are going places, selling houses, you know, going and renting, they are going to enjoy their period of time while they're healthy. And this campground is sneaky. These RV parks are sneaky, aren't they. Yeah? Yeah, And it's it's the elderly, for sure, but it's also the number of friends I have in the past year who have just gone on the road for like six months or longer and just traveled because as we become a remote world, a remote working world, you don't have to work in an office. You don't have to work at home either. You can like starlink, you just put it. Like my buddy just bought a van, put a starlink on the van and is now just like he just left twice, lived here for five years with me right next to me, and he just left to go be a full time van life guy. And there's gonna go stay at campgrounds around the country. He's gonna work on his computer in the back of the van. So there's this whole like again the hockey puck is changing the way that we work. So yeah, campgrounds fascinating. Here's what I'm always fast in my campgrounds. Number one campground when everyone thinks about it nationwide, it is Koa. Everyone knows Koa is the campground. What's number two? I don't I don't know. There isn't one. I mean there's a collection of them called like Good like Sam Good something like that, but even that Good Sam, right, Yeah, but it's like that's like a that's kind of a loose federation or collection of campgrounds versus like a company. So anyway, whenever I see that there's a coke without a PEPSI I'm like, oh, this is the industry for disruption, Like who's the number two? Who's going to come in and take away the mom and popishness of the industry And somebody will yeah, because Kawas are incredible systems company Like I stay at Kaways when I go camping. I like them because I always know what to expect it there. The McDonald's of campgrounds and every other campground I go to is not like that, and so there's massive opportunities there. The puck is moving, there's opportunity, there's branding around that, there's social media around that. I paid eight hundred dollars a night to stay in an airstream trailer about an hour and a half from Yosemite because I wanted an Instagram picture of me and my family is staying in an airstream trailer. Right. It was totally driven by hubris and an ego to be able to say, look at me camping in airstreams. I paid eight hundred dollars a night to stay in one. I think expensive photo. It was an expensive photo, but man, it looked really good, but it was It was more. It was an experience. And that's what I think people are craving experience in a world where we lack, like you know, uh, we're affordability as a problem. You could have an experience without doing a twenty thousand dollars you know, Disney trip, and you can do it in campgrounds. So I thin, I'll tell you this is interesting that it's on your list, because I don't know if I told you this, but I bought an airstream Mercedes and I Drew. I bought it last summer. I drove it up to Idaho, down through Park City, all the way across the country, stopped in Nashville, North Carolina. And we did this and and I did it for two reasons. One wanted to I wanted to go see the country and go hang out and see what van life would be like. I also bought the starlink, stuck it on the top. We had all the connectivity. We were coldly fine. What we ended up what we ended up realizing is that some of these I remember, like one of our stops was Jackson Hole, Wyoming. I wanted to go to the Tetons and Yellowstone, which I did, and we stayed there for I think three or four nights. But you know, the coach is pulling in are five hundred thousand million dollars, you know, like you know what we e did. I've like, all of a sudden, you go, hey, I need a bigger you know, I need this, I need I need this. All of a sudden, You're in this new world. There's a tremendous culture, how to your point, that's doing this, and there there's a little bit of freedom with it. And they got slide outs, they've got all this stuff, and they got a whole deal. They take their family on the road, you know. And and it was an incredible experience. And I did it specifically to try to understand r V parks. Yeah the financial standpoint, right, Yeah, it was an incredible experience. Yeah, that's that's awesome man. Yeah, we did it. We did four months in an airstream and went around the country with my kids, and yeah, it was both magical and difficult in a lot of ways. But we stated a lot of Koa's, We saw a lot of how they were operating, and it really got me fired up, you know what. Not real estate related but a side business that I think is a tremendous opportunity right now, and that's RV repair Because of all the RVs that were bought during COVID, there's just a tremendous amount. They break down so easy. I mean every day, something in my in my in my airstream grope every day. It's true, there's a massive opportunity there in terms of being a repair shop for them. What also, thing I just wanted to point out, you know, I hadn't done this before, and I wanted to do it, and I'm glad I did it. Some of these places we would pull into, like I'll just use let's say Jackson Hole or Park City or Moab or wherever we were. You you're talking about one hundred to two hundred dollars per night, Yeah, for a pad. So the guys like, picture of this you're pulling on to maybe concrete maybe not, and it's a it's got water and power and probably a little barbecue sitting next to it at a little patchrick maybe Yeah. And that's that's call it one hundred and fifty to two hundred dollars a night, right, So so you know, think about think of those numbers just for a moment, just just for a pad, yep, And then you see them and there's just row after row after row of hundreds of these things parked there, and I'm like, dang, like that's a business right there, I know. And then the other thing that I thought was cool is some of the bigger, more well developed parks and some of the some of these parks really had their stuff together. Some did not, which is again the opportunity. And but some of them, like you're just tired that Darren Van, you know, and they had like little rentols like like a studio or a house or you know, one bedroom that you could rent for the night and you know, just had the full shower and all that kind of stuff. So so they're getting kind of creative and they're they're listening to the consumer as well. Right, Yeah, Yeah, that industry is just fascinating and ripe for disruption. There's there's some there's big things come in that and uh and yeah, somebody listening to this might be somebody that leads it. And then there's opportunity, I think. So I think so so anything else that you can think of that some of these new niches and the real sting is uh. There's a lot of things that are getting clobber and a lot of people are talking about like office buildings and certainly got a multi family low at the moment. But there's a lot of little niches, you know, there really are there's I think I made a list the other day of like I think nineteen les so I can pull it up my giant list here. Yeah, it was right here. It was uh, and not always are good everywhere, but like I throw, small multi family properties still work. Assisted living, sober living is interesting. Short term rentals in the right areas, rent by the room we talked about. The mid sized multifamily is interesting because it's so darn hard. What I mean by that is like the you know, the fifty unit that's like too small for a good management company it. But I mean I've owned I've owned twenty four unit parks, I mean twenty four unit apartments before. Incredibly difficult to manage, but opportunity there. Yeah, that's about build the rent. It's interesting home barx, campgrounds, mid term rentals or corporate housing that's super popular right now where you're renting the traveling nurses, self storage, ad US student rentals, turning office into storage, co working centers, group homes for development to disabled industrial warehouse like Amazon warehouse stuff. And then like service based strip malls or something that kind of fascinates me. Not yeah, not malls, but service based ones. So you you know, they've got the tobacco shop in there, they've got a hair salon, they've got a nail salon, a massage place. It's stuff that yeah, in any in any economy, Amazon's not taking it away. Yeah, I love well. First of all, great, it's a great list. I have. I have bluddy. I have buddy that has done the converted the office to a self storage heavy Yeah. I haven't played that in place yet, but I like it a lot. You know, we do some self storage, so I'm gonna think we're looking hard at that stuff. Heck of a niche because you don't need the parking yep, and and it's all and uh, you know, there's no tenants, you know, so you don't need the windows and all the you know, the plumbing and all that. So so and by the way, as you guys probably know, office buildings are are taking into the gin right now. So that's what also sober living unfortunately, uh, you know, addiction. Everything really spiked during the pandemic. And that's another one. I got a buddy that's doing that, and he has the state paying all his rent. Yeah, Like he found a place and basically bought it and the state basically puts the tenets in there and gives them rent. Yep. Yeah, I got a friend doing the thing. I actually have two friends do the exact same thing. They buy these houses and they know exactly what the program needs and they're not operating, like both my friends that are running it, they're not operating. There's a company called or a group called the Oxford House, which is like a I'm not sure exactly. It's like pseudo government. I'm not exactly sure how they're if they're if they're like Fanny me Freddy Max style government, I'm not really sure. But there's somehow government related and yeah, you just buy the house and you rent it to the Oxford House, and then the Oxford House handles. They pay the rent flat every single month, and so they kind of just work in their numbers. They say, hey, I need to get a twelve percent cash on cash or whatever the number is, and they just go out in there analyzing a ton of deals, making offers, and then when one lands that they just rent it out to Oxford and make their cash flow and move on. It's fascinating model. It is fascinating. So I we're getting close to wrapping up, but I wanted to thank you for coming to Limitless. It's an end of August August. Yeah, I thought thirty first. Yeah, I know you've come every year. I appreciate that and any idea like we're going to be in August and yeah, he has on what you want to discuss, you know, I think I'll probably end up talking about something like this about cash flow. Yeah, because it's just the majority of people are not Yeah, everyone's either afraid or everybody is saying it's not working, and just like oh yeah, I'm just sitting it out. I'm just gonna wait. But I'm like, dang, there's ways right now to invest in real estate. And you know, all end with this kind of metaphor, right when when you were playing baseball as a kid, like I remember, I'd always walk up to the plate, I'm getting ready to bat bat next right, I'd pick up four or five baseball bats at one time, and I would swing all four or five a bunch of times, right Why because you want to get your muscles used to that heavyweight. Then you walk up to the plate and you have one bat and it feels light, it feels easy, so you can knock that ball harder. Right now, we're swinging with multiple bats like now is the time to get stronger and to practice and to keep taking those swings rather than saying I'm just gonna sit out and wait for the market to improve, because you're gonna be waiting a long long time, I think. So. Yeah, That's what I'm going to keep preaching is keep going. I love it, man. That's a great way to end it. Brandon. As always, buddy, thank you. I can't wait to see you in August. I can't thank you enough for being at limitless at the end of the at the end of August, and also appreciated being better life. Good luck on that. You want to wrap up with that real quick and tell us a little bit about better life, Yeah, I mean better life is a real estate what I call an accountability mastermind. So we put you in small groups of on ability groups. We have a leader of each group, and it just basically makes sure you do the stuff that you know you need to do because most people lack self discipline, myself included. But when someone's making sure that I'm doing my stuff I'm supposed to be doing, I just progress further in life. So that's what we do. We got a thousand people that are all working towards goals by getting accountability and great people too. So I enjoyed coming to thank you for inviting me and thank you for for coming. It was awesome. It was a great as all. We grabbed that coffee. I know it's the nine thirty ten o'clock in Hawaii, so that it is. Hey, big hugs to your family. Appreciate your time as always, and we'll see you soon. Appreciate you ken you see you, buddy. Thank you for listening to this episode of the Real Estate Strategies podcast. If you liked what you heard, please give us a five star review on iTunes and let us know what you thought of today's episode. Thank you, and we'll see you next week.